Jonathan Drake

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Posts by Jonathan Drake

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  55

  The contempt of Anthony Morris: the face doesn't lie.

  by freemindfade in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  i have noticed something even long before even looking into ttatt, something about morris bothered me.

  i am personally very attuned to body language, facial expressions and general subtleties in human interaction.

  there was something about his face that really bothered me, and i will explain it.

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  Jonathan Drake

  Omg I was wondering if anyone else saw this!!!

  
  

  thank you! I've seen this for years, he hates these people for taking his picture at the very least. 
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  23

  The Bible's approval of slavery (including Jesus)

  by rebel8 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how can there possibly be a reason for this?

  smh.

  i can't imagine how this is excusable..

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  Jonathan Drake

  Ok actually yea that is what it says. Couldn't wait until tomorrow.

  
  

  Look at Exodus 21:2-6. In this scenario, it specifies that if the wife was not a Hebrew, and the slave man had children with her, her and the children remained with the master. They were never freed, by seniority, by jubilee year, nothing; and they were passed on as inheritance. UNLESS the master chose to free them, which was always his right. 
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  23

  The Bible's approval of slavery (including Jesus)

  by rebel8 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how can there possibly be a reason for this?

  smh.

  i can't imagine how this is excusable..

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  Jonathan Drake

  @ village 

  
  

  I'll look at this more tomorrow. i think that's a very good question. I would say from what we've considered so far, as a preliminary guess, that the master would still keep them. Because it sounds like the scenario in your question is exactly what has happened in that scripture. I.e., I'm a Hebrew, my wife is not, we have kids. 7 years go by, I'm free, wife isn't, kids aren't. The master can choose to free them, or I can choose the awl. If they are Hebrews as well, a third choice exists of waiting for their freedom. 

  but again, that's a guess. I'll read over the requirements tomorrow. 
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  23

  The Bible's approval of slavery (including Jesus)

  by rebel8 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how can there possibly be a reason for this?

  smh.

  i can't imagine how this is excusable..

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  Jonathan Drake

  Don't get me wrong it IS different. But not vastly so. I.e., no employer is laying a hand on you to discipline you when you do something wrong or are a terrible employee. Whereas a master in the bible is allowed to beat the slave. 

  But the bible has very strict rules about how slaves are treated. Since I'm posting again I'll include why the awl throuh the ear bit isn't as bad as it sounds. A slave WHO CAME WITH his wife took his wife when he left. The only time the master kept the wife and kids is when he was the one who provided the wife, and the slave didn't bring his wife originally. So, there is a huge difference here that isn't explained at all in that article. This tells me there are likely many other things they either left out on purpose, or missed because they are ignorant.

  also it should be pointed out that though the master COULD keep the wife and kids, that doesn't mean he always did. This was a guideline, a law showing the masters rights but that didn't mean this is how they ALWAYS chose to proceed.
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  23

  The Bible's approval of slavery (including Jesus)

  by rebel8 in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  how can there possibly be a reason for this?

  smh.

  i can't imagine how this is excusable..

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  Jonathan Drake

  the kind of slavery condoned in the bible is not vastly different from the slavery we still have today. I.e, we are all our employers slaves. 

  The bible did not allow the Israelites to mistreat their slaves. Some of the references made in the OP article I'm fairly certain aren't even correct.

  if this thread is still going tomorrow I'll be sure to post a more informative reply, but it's late and I'm very tired.
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  13

  The god of the bible doesn't care and here's some proof.

  by Crazyguy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  around 600 ad a man named muhammed created a book called the quran.

  a few hundred years later the followers of this new religion called islam went on a holy crusade out of arabia to spread their religion.

  in one key battle they were met by the ruling government army and were out numbered at least by 3 to 1. they could of easily lost and if god would of made sure of this most likely thier religion would of stayed an insagnificant religion of just arabia.

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  Jonathan Drake

  Technically he didn't copy anything. He didn't read or write. Muhammed was illiterate. Also i didn't say that the Muslims believe he was the messiah, but that the Quran calls him such. Like I said above, as with much of Christianity, Muslims don't really actually listen to what the Quran says. At least not so far as I have seen.

  
  

  The Quran chapter 3 verse 45: "The Angels said, "Mary, God gives you news of a Word from Him, whose name will be the Messiah, Jesus, son of Mary, who will be held in honour in this world and the next, who will be one of those brought near to God."

  
  

  
  
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  10

  PESHER: an Historic scheme of INTERPRETING SCRIPTURE. . . Watchtower style!

  by TerryWalstrom in

  1. watchtower
  2. bible

  george bernard shaw said: no man ever believes that the bible means what it says.

  he is always convinced that it says what he means.. shaw must have had pesher in mind!

  but, what is pesher?.

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  Jonathan Drake

  I agree with that approach. That's what I've been doing. I've been studying the cultures around the Christian movement mostly right now. Only light reading of ancient customs (like ot). 

  
  

  So so far my favorite book on culture is Daily Life in the Times of Jesus by Henri Daniel-Rops. I really enjoy that book.
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  20

  East Coast Blizzard 2015

  by breakfast of champions in

  1. jw
  2. friends

  where we're at, we won't get it as bad as nyc, long island or new england.

  even so, my university is closed until wednesday morning, and we're expecting well over a foot of snow.. anyone else out there "hunkering down"?.

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  Jonathan Drake

  To any caught in its path, I hope you stay safe. You and your neighbors are in my thoughts. 
• 
  13

  The god of the bible doesn't care and here's some proof.

  by Crazyguy in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  around 600 ad a man named muhammed created a book called the quran.

  a few hundred years later the followers of this new religion called islam went on a holy crusade out of arabia to spread their religion.

  in one key battle they were met by the ruling government army and were out numbered at least by 3 to 1. they could of easily lost and if god would of made sure of this most likely thier religion would of stayed an insagnificant religion of just arabia.

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  Jonathan Drake

  Except the qoran does call Christ a messiah and states he was a death equal to Adam just like the bible does. It also states emphatically that the bible should be taken as inspire word and everything the qoran says is meant to be taken with the bible as a confirmation of it. 

  
  

  So, I would submit that the issue isn't the qoran, but rather how it's been twisted and interpreted- same as the bible.

  
  

  consider for example how the western world responded to the Ottoman Empire. When the Muslims were on their crusade, they didn't harm the citizens of the countries they took over unless those people attacked - at which point they defended themselves. the only people they killed are those who attacked them like soldiers. If they could take them captive they did, at which point they accepted Islam or died. 

  
  

  Now compare that to the crusades headed up by the Catholic Church. They not only beat the Ottoman Empire back the the Middle East, but they invaded their towns, especially Jerusalem, and killed every man woman and child they came across. They had no mercy at all. The blood running in the courtyard of the temple area is recorded to have been ankle deep when the crusaders were finally done, with body parts piled up on street corners. 

  
  

  The Ottoman Empire showed far more mercy, and would never have killed innocents arbitrarily like the church army did (or, ironically, as Isis or alqueda do today).

  
  

  personally, I think the crusaders were far more barbaric and terrible than the ottoman army was. 

  
  

  Source, this book: http://www.booksamillion.com/p/Templars/Piers-Paul-Read/9780312555382?id=6223161565069

  
  

  which i I no longer have because someone borrowed and never returned.
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  32

  "GB=Faithful slave" TRUE reason for change revealed

  by Viva la Vida in

  1. watchtower
  2. beliefs

  john ekrann, a helper to the gb, revealed the true reason for the change was protecting jws from apostates and other "anointed" christians.. see: http://tv.jw.org/#video/vodprogramsevents/pub-jwbmw_e_201501_2_video (around 4:55ms).

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  Jonathan Drake

  He is so wrong. And it's so easy to prove it scripturally. notice he provides no real study or proof, he just says "it makes sense". I'd love to sit down with him and a bible and educate him on what a "Steward" was in Jewish culture and how they were appointed. (Isaiah 22:20-22; compare Matt 16:19)